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mare_serenitatis
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welcome Morthland

Post by mare_serenitatis » Fri May 18, 2007 7:39 pm

:hello: look who found us! :welcome:

Welcome to the board! :bighug:

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Post by D.Rabbit » Fri May 18, 2007 8:33 pm

Yeah Morthland!
Long time no goof around with.
Good to see you found us!
D.
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Post by IrisD » Sat May 19, 2007 6:06 am

Hi, welcome to the crazy crowd.
What does not kill me, makes me stronger.
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Post by Jun » Sun May 20, 2007 2:03 am

Welcome :D
月日は百代の過客にして行き交う歳もまた旅人なり

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Post by sprinkles » Mon May 21, 2007 3:20 pm

Whow another blast from the pass, Welcome Mothland. Nice to see ya still around
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Post by Morthland » Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:07 pm

Thanks guys - it took me this long to figure out how to get back on the message board; if I try to post the addie in the addie line, it claims I can't get on - I finally figured out to go to yahoo and list Keith Hamilton Cobb - it took a couple of pages but there you are! It is so good to see the names of old friends.
What am I up to? I just finished ushering 2x/week at Philly Shakespeare Festival - it's such a small theater that they normally don't seat latecomers and the usher gets to see the play! So I got to watch the development of the plays over the run. The Othello was marvelous - Brian Wilson is a great Othello, but the play needs three things - a great Othello, then a believable Iago and Desdemona. Karl Hanover was a marvelous Iago - deliciously evil when he's being himself, but charming enough to persuade folks to his schemes. And Christie Parker was a marvelous Desdemona; sometimes the part is played so saccharine and innocent you want to scream, Christie was just right.
My personal favorite was the Taming of the Shrew - set in the 40s like a Marx Brothers comedy. As the oldest daughter of an oldest daughter of an oldest daughter, I care that the play was done right - here's Katharine running her father's household since the time her mother died (notice the absence of a housekeeper or nurse in the play) - trying to get servants to obey her at that young an age almost necessitated her being nasty at times. And once she got that reputation, she was stuck with it. Meanwhile, Bianca been able to be Daddy's Little Girl. The interesting thing was the fact that I came to the conclusion that Petruchio had to have had several sisters - and Damon Bonetti played him that way. (calling her Kate instead of Katherine is something a brother would do to tease a sister - in the play he even tickles her in that first scene together.)
The best thing was that the entire cast was good and worked very well to gether. I got everyone except Brian Wilson to sign the back to the season's poster and one of them mentioned that they had all enjoyed working with each other.
Note - I am going to post interesting info on next season on another post.
Now how are all of you doing? I will enjoy getting to know all of the folks who weren't on the old board, but it's so great to see folks from it - I gather the economy is doing well in Germany - how are you all doing, Mare and Iris, et al? And Jun, how are you all in Japan? It's hard to get the Asian news on pbs nowadays, so I'm not as familiar as I am with Germany, France and England.
Karin, how's the cooking? I thought about suggesting a fundraising cookbook to Carmen Khan for Philly Shakespeare Festival. Petruchio says "I dressed the meat myself" - so I figure there's room for a grilled meat recipe - and a quote in Midsummer Night's Dream would be appropriate for a summer fruit salad or dessert. Have you any ideas?

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Post by Cyowari » Sat Jun 02, 2007 2:37 pm

Hello Morthland, nice to meet you!
Morthland wrote: The Othello was marvelous - Brian Wilson is a great Othello, but the play needs three things - a great Othello, then a believable Iago and Desdemona.
I agree. It's like 'Romeo and Juliet' - that play needs a believable Mercutio. I always fall in love with the Mercutios ...
Morthland wrote: My personal favorite was the Taming of the Shrew - set in the 40s like a Marx Brothers comedy.
I'm still not sure if I go for the idea, that Petrucchio really "tames" Kate (and that means brutal force and is not comical at all), or if I prefer them both to fall in love with each other and only play-act the last scene to mock the others.
Thank you for sharing your theatre experience!
Morthland wrote: I gather the economy is doing well in Germany
Not for everyone ... There are some unhappy dregs left, who will be driven over by economy and history.
Morthland wrote: I thought about suggesting a fundraising cookbook to Carmen Khan for Philly Shakespeare Festival. Have you any ideas?
Try:
www.foodtimeline.org/foodfag3.html#shakespeare
www.mirabilis.ca/archives/001714.html
www.francinesegan.com/sk.html
www.teachersfirst.com/lessons/shak-feast.htm
There should be a nice strawberry recipe ('Richard III', act 3, scene 4). Some scientists say, there is a hint of an allergy Richard's to strawberries.
Then up he rose, and donn'd his clothes, / And dupp'd the chamber-door;
Let in the maid, that out a maid / Never departed more.
Hamlet, Act IV, Sc. V

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Post by Morthland » Sat Jun 02, 2007 5:16 pm

Well the Taming of the Shrew was done as a love story - there were literally moments when they stopped and got lost in each other. There were things I would have done a little differently (in John Cleese's Shrew, I think he used a comic voice in the speech about 'if I say it's the sun or moon..." and Kate actually giggled.) If I remember Kate did her speech as tongue in cheek. I would have like to have seen that in this production, but it was done with the love showing - Petruchio was almost sure Kate would show up in the last scene with the bet, but her speech bowled him over. By the way, she walks to the wedding with him in her grungy wedding suit, but the dress and cap that he "threw away" were what she was wearing for Bianca's wedding. The director had gotten the psychology of Katherine's life - she was the older daughter who had to take over the household when her mother died. At a fairly young age, she would have had to done some screaming or other nastiness when she needed to control obstreperous servants - and once you develop a reputation like that, you get stuck with it; people don't notice when you try to be nice, so she would have given up - especially as she hadn't run into any men she found interesting until Petruchio shows up. This is probably the first man who ever beat her at a battle of wits. In spite of having to be upset at his vulgarity - she still would have found that sexy.
That's an older daughter thing. I think you would have enjoyed it. I wish there was a way to get our local pbs tv station to record their productions.

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Post by mare_serenitatis » Sat Jun 09, 2007 4:47 am

Taming is the only Shakespeare play I thoroughly dislike. I mean, there's a girl who is emancipated, has her own will and refuses to be married off by her dad to a guy she doesn't like. What's so bad about it?
And then she gets humiliated, scared and terrorized by a man until she's finally brainwashed into a nice housewife. IMO she deserved something better.
War doesn't decide who is right. It only decides who is left.

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Post by Cyowari » Sat Jun 09, 2007 5:38 am

1. To an Elizabethan audience an emancipated girl was a shrew and a terror in the house and the way she gets "tamed" WAS funny to them - it deserved her right. (And imagine all roles played by men!)

2. There is a modern tradition since the 1920s to play the thing with tongue in cheek: Kate and Petruccio fall in love very early in the play and just keep up their fight not to lose their face (and Petruccio his deal). In that case Kate's subjugation is just a trick to fool the others.

There are other omedies by Shakespeare that deal rather harsh and not comical al all with women.
What happens to the brides in 'Much Ado' and in 'All's Well'? How does Oberon treat Titania?
Then up he rose, and donn'd his clothes, / And dupp'd the chamber-door;
Let in the maid, that out a maid / Never departed more.
Hamlet, Act IV, Sc. V

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Post by D.Rabbit » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:43 pm

Cyowari wrote:1. To an Elizabethan audience an emancipated girl was a shrew and a terror in the house and the way she gets "tamed" WAS funny to them - it deserved her right. (And imagine all roles played by men!)
It's not much different then the naughty teenage girl who is out after dark and meets up with some psychopathic killer. Or the female executive who is brutally slain in the parking garage on her way home. It's been a male chauvinistic dominated world, and still is in many parts of it, where women need to be kept in their place.

I can see how we emancipated women find this type of plot line demoralizing to women.

It's only in super heroes scenarios and Sci Fi that women take control and are their own writers of their destiny. Other wise, women are victims if for no other reason then we are the, "weaker sex."
Weak has many connotations, and if the truth be know, weak can also be applied to these type of victimize the female, scripts.
2. There is a modern tradition since the 1920s to play the thing with tongue in cheek: Kate and Petruccio fall in love very early in the play and just keep up their fight not to lose their face (and Petruccio his deal). In that case Kate's subjugation is just a trick to fool the others.
Good way to keep it less controversial
There are other comedies by Shakespeare that deal rather harsh and not comical al all with women.
What happens to the brides in 'Much Ado' and in 'All's Well'? How does Oberon treat Titania?
Much Ado falls deep into the victimize the females, poor Hero. What about Lady Macbeth? Here she is in a position of power, and loses her mind, making her yet another hysterical female.

Women have had to deal with being subjugated for so long we got very good at using hysteria and feigning weakness, just to get our way. :P It's not necessarily the males' fault, we let it happen, the fact that we have to fight to get back to par with them, is our letting them get away with it for so long. After all, who rules a man when he is but a child, and who forms him in his formative years? Women.
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Post by Cyowari » Sun Jun 10, 2007 3:11 pm

The only glimpse of hope in 'Much Ado' is the Beatrice/Benedict relation.
And do you remember what they say about Lady Macbeth: She becomes such a murderous wench because she is barren. Ha! Being able to give birth is what makes women tolerable and useful?
Then up he rose, and donn'd his clothes, / And dupp'd the chamber-door;
Let in the maid, that out a maid / Never departed more.
Hamlet, Act IV, Sc. V

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Post by D.Rabbit » Sun Jun 10, 2007 5:43 pm

At least we are good for something! ;)

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Post by mare_serenitatis » Tue Jun 12, 2007 4:21 am

I am not all that sure if Lady Macbeth really lost her mind. Take the sleepwalking scene for example. She's supposed to be running around in her sleep because of her guilty conscience. But who has ever heard of a sleepwalker carrying a candle? IMO she's deliberately putting up a show for those she knows are watching her. I think she is convinced her hubby murdered the king and she somewhat clumsily tries to shield him by blaming herself.
Look at Macbeth from the point of view of a reader of murder mysteries: the obvious suspects are always innocent.

Macbeth: good motive, but remember he's a very successful military leader. He knows about good strategies. Would he be so foolish as to kill Duncan under his own roof? A guest was sacred in these times. Every harm coming to your guest would fall back on you and ruin your reputation.
Lady Macbeth: same reason. She's no fool. She wouldn't start her hubby's career by spoiling his good rep.

Who did it then? Someone who wanted Macbeth's social status destroyed.
Who had a motive? His colleagues in the army who were pissed about him getting promoted while their successes weren't honoured are my #1 suspects.

Duncan's sons have a motive as well: Macbeth got too powerful and they might have heard rumours about the prophecy. There was a certain risk that Macbeth might rise so much in Duncan's grace that he'd be able to influence the king against his sons. How useful to blame the murder on the competitor and get old daddy out of the way at the same time. Their flight was rather foolish because it makes them look suspicious but they have a good excuse, claiming they were scared to be the next ones killed. Besides, they must have been aware that Macbeth wouldn't have hesitated to kill them personally had he found out that they did it. And two teenagers wouldn't have a chance in a fight against a warlord.

Banquo had a strong motive too. His sons would become kings. And he might have been jealous because of Macbeth's promotions. After all, they fought side by side and only Macbeth got promoted while he, Banquo, didn't even get so much as a handshake from Duncan.

On the whole I think everyone else but the Macbeths is likely to have killed Duncan.
War doesn't decide who is right. It only decides who is left.

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Post by Cyowari » Tue Jun 12, 2007 5:52 pm

Interesting train of thought, mare!
I always saw the Scottish Play as a story about the self fulfilling prophecies: If you think that something will happen (paricularly when someone put this thought in your head under mysterious circumstances) you will do everything - conciously or subconciously, willingly or full of fear - to make it come true.
All the characters in 'Oedipus Rex' act that way and that way further the tragedy.
Or: if you believe in "unlucky days" (in Germany that would be a Friday, 13th), misfortune will happen to you. Misfortune can happen to you any day, but when it happens on an "unlucky day" you will notice it and blaim it on the day. And when you are afraid, because you think this was an "unlucky day", you will get clumpsy and distracted and you will make more mistakes than usually.

If you are interested in a Shakespearian story looked at as a crime thriller, did you ever read Josephine Tey's 'The Daughter of Time'? It's about 'Richard III' and proves he did not kill the little princes but was a very sweet and loveable person. Good writing and good reading.
Then up he rose, and donn'd his clothes, / And dupp'd the chamber-door;
Let in the maid, that out a maid / Never departed more.
Hamlet, Act IV, Sc. V

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