The Mars Thread

[Lupine]

Looks like some oxygen has been detected on Mars. Interestingly this isn't the first time either.

[RJDiogenes]

Interesting. They found only half what they expected, but there wasn't much context. I wonder if it's seasonal, like the methane.

[Lupine]

Yet another story about oxygen on Mars- at least in the distant past. Granted there is a non-biological explanation possible, but coupled with the last story it does start to make one think.

[RJDiogenes]

"Here on Earth, we had lots of water but no widespread deposits of manganese oxides until after the oxygen levels in our atmosphere rose due to photosynthesizing microbes."

So far, abundant atmospheric oxygen has been treated as a so-called biosignature, or a sign of existing life.

These facts are very telling. The researchers are being very cautious, as they should be, but, as you say, the evidence is mounting. I have few doubts left that Mars at least once had life.

[Lupine]

An interesting article about the disconnect between the climate models of ancient Mars and what the rocks are saying. Funny enough there's a similar conundrum in the field of human origins (or at least there was until recently). Computer studies suggested that humans and chimps diverged as recently as 4.5 million years ago, however the fossil record is suggesting numbers as high as 7 million or more. To me the answer is simple (for human origins and Mars). The rocks are right. All evidence has to bow to the rocks.

[scottydog]

^^ Interesting how we're somehow caught by surprise by the complexity of a planet's origins or by our origins as a species.

[RJDiogenes]

I think it will all come together when we discover that chimps came from Mars.

This is really fantastic. The more we learn about ancient Mars, the more likely it becomes that life existed there. And if life existed there then, chances are good that something is still alive way down in the nooks and crannies.

[Lupine]

Curiosity has dropped us some truly stunning pics of Mars!

[RJDiogenes]

Wow, I've never seen anything like that from Mars before. The color is amazing (I wonder if the colors are what we would actually see if we were there-- they look very natural) and the haze in the distance is remarkable (presumably dust, not mist). And the sunlight falling on the rocks is brighter than I've ever seen. I feel like I could step right into the scenery. Were those sedimentary layers formed by water or wind, I wonder.

[scottydog]

^ Those are amazing pics of Mars indeed. Not as red as I expected. And like the article said, it's similar to parts of Utah and Arizona that I've seen, minus any vegetation of course.

Has anyone been discussing the ethics of terraforming this planet, or other planets? Should we try to alter conditions on Mars to accommodate human life, or would that be like bulldozing the grand canyon for developers?

[Lupine]

^That's an interesting analogy. Carl Sagan briefly covered the topic in his Cosmos TV series with his position being that terraforming would be all right as long as nothing lived on Mars. But he insisted that we shouldn't if there was so much as a microbe on the planet. But the thought of keeping Mars as it is for the sake of preservation is a provocative idea.

[RJDiogenes]

Yes, terraforming will inspire some serious debates when we have the technology to do it. It actually already has, but it's just academic at this point. As it is, we go to great lengths to ensure that no Earth microbes hitch a ride to Mars (not to mention the moons of Jupiter and Saturn). The thing is, it may be a very long time before we're sure about life on Mars, because it will be buried very deeply under the surface-- maybe miles. Personally, I'm very much in favor of settling Mars and maybe terraforming-- but the thing is, in addition to the preservation angle, terraforming could be dangerous. Suppose there are a few hardy bacteria deep down under the surface, struggling to survive in the heart of a dying world. Then suppose we fix that world so that it's not dying anymore. In fact, it's pretty balmy and benign. What happens to that bacteria then? And what happens to the colonists from Earth who encounter that bacteria?

[Lupine]

^Good story materiel there. Like The Andromeda Strain in reverse.

As it is, we go to great lengths to ensure that no Earth microbes hitch a ride to Mars (not to mention the moons of Jupiter and Saturn).

And according to an article I read in Popular Science a few years back we've already failed. There are several microbes that are virtually impossible to kill and probably are already on Mars.

[scottydog]

...But the thought of keeping Mars as it is for the sake of preservation is a provocative idea.

I would do sort of what we do here, namely, designate some particularly beautiful terrain as Martian Parkland that remains untouched. Then develop the ugly areas.

Suppose there are a few hardy bacteria deep down under the surface, struggling to survive in the heart of a dying world. Then suppose we fix that world so that it's not dying anymore. In fact, it's pretty balmy and benign. What happens to that bacteria then? And what happens to the colonists from Earth who encounter that bacteria?

I really like this story idea. And it could come true with gruesome consequences for colonists. I think that's why I'd never volunteer to be the first generation of settlers on faraway worlds.

[Lupine]

I think that's why I'd never volunteer to be the first generation of settlers on faraway worlds.

I would, just because it's there.